Jackie Skelly Fitness: Club Membership Rip-off: Popular Complaints |
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BackgroundJackie Skelly uses a range of established and disreputable (though not illegal) modern sales techniques to extract as much money from punters as possible. Some of these techniques will be familiar to you from shady second-hand car dealers and unscrupulous insurance salesmen. One indicator is that prices will vary wildly - the sales team will try to get you to commit to as much as possible - but if a "special offer" is necessary to get you to sign then one will be available. One objective is to get you to commit in writing to pay for a year's membership. The words you hear may well not match the words on the piece of paper in front of you - so beware what you are committing to. You may not think of joining a club as creating a legally binding contract, but Jackie Skelly does. And Jackie Skelly will use the same techniques to enforce their supposed contract that you would expect of the dodgier end of the second hand car market. If you thought Jackie Skelly Fitness was something to do with fitness or health then think again. The principle business activity of Jackie Skelly Fitness Limited as recorded when the company was created is "ACTIVITIES AUXILIARY TO FINANCIAL INTERMEDIATION N.E.C" If you want to leave the club and stop paying you will find that there is no exercise of the normal degree of understanding that you would expect of a genuine Club. Indeed if you want to leave, the people you speak to will tell you that they are not empowered to terminate the contract. They might have been deceived into believing that Jackie Skelly Fitness has no power to accede to your request to dissolve the contract - though of course this is nonsense. Jackie Skelly Fitness is not bound by some authoritarian legal constraint. What they really mean is that they (the managers in the Health Club) have been instructed by the directors of Jackie Skelly Fitness to take the most inflexible line they can legally get away with. Their first reaction will be to reach for a copy of the contract and then inform you that they have no choice - and neither do you. You will have to keep paying, and if you do not the heavy mob - professional debt collectors - will move in. You can see some the more outrageous terms in this extract from one of their suposed contracts.
Is this Reasonable?There are several reasons to believe that this is approaching sharp business practice. Abuse is common in pretty much all industries where the sales force is paid on commission. Human nature being what it is, sales people naturally have an interest in getting you to sign, whatever your needs, or stated wishes, and their oral assurances that you are not committing to a year's membership are worthless. Jackie Skelly does not follow good practice here - and indeed it is difficult to see why a Health Club - rather than a commercial enterprise - needs to follow this route of pushing annual membership . It looks like Jackie skelly wants to get a long-term commitment precisely because so many punters do not want to make a long term commitment, either initially or once they see what they get for their money. What's the evidence for this being bad practice? Answer: the large number of punters who have found themselves paying for membership that did not realise they had signed up for. You can find dozens of then on various message boards (see below). A second answer is the large amount of Jackie Skelly's "Bad Debt". A third is the aggressive and wholly unreasonable attitude of Jackie Skelly's management team. Jackie Skelly also has a very bad reputation for mysteriously losing any notification that you want to terminate your contract even after 12 months. If you call in person, telephone, e-mail, fax or write then all record of your communication is likely to be lost and they will claim never to have recieved it. Any verbal assurances they give are utterly worthless - we have dozens of examples of blatent lies. Any communication should therefore be made by recorded delivery letter - that way they cannot argue that they did not recieve it. According to the small print in the "membership contract form" you will be committed to pay up every month even if you were to move abroad, lose your job, have all of your limbs mangled in an accident or fall into a permanent vegetative state. In extreme circumstances you might be able to "suspend" your membership for up to three months with a doctor's certificate and a medical interogation by one of their debt collectors - and that is just to delay your payments. There are no circumstances in which you can cancel your membership within the first 12 month period or with immediate effect after the 12 month period. If you do not cancel your "annual contract" after 10 months [sic] then it will just keep running, and money will keep disappearing from your bank account after you tell them in the twelfth month that you do not wish to renew.
Am I Bound by my One-Year Contract ?No liability accepted for following this advice. (Any experience from others much appreciated - especially actual legal precedents - contact details below). Obviously, your best option is to read any contract carefully before signing - resist the sales person's blandishments that you can read them later at leisure after you sign. If you want to vary the conditions in any way - eg to be able to cancel on request - then add that new condtion to the document in writing and get a copy. if you have already signed, then the following is the best advice we can currently give. You have every right to terminate the contract if Skellyweg's fail to fullfill their part of the agreement. Faling to provide a safe or clean environment will do - and many customers say that Skellyweg premisses fail on both counts. If you want to terminate do not use the club. Write a letter to Jackie Skelly Fitness at the company's registered address, saying that you do not accept that a contract exists (if one ever did) and that if they think that one does exist then they need to be aware that you have rescinded any such contract. Use registered mail for this and keep your proof of delivery. The legal position in Ireland is a little bit hazy, but basically the same as other Common Law jurisdictions. If you have never used the Club then you can argue that no consideration has passed, so on a quantum meruit basis you have nothing to pay. (Basically you are liable for the "services" you have "consumed" but not for any further services). The court may even require Skellywegs to repay money already paid to them for periods when you have not used their facilities. In principal, the legal remedies for breach of contract are specific performance or damages. Specific performance means you have to stick to the contract. Despite what Jackie Skelly Fitness staff might try to tell you damages are not likely to be significant for contracts of this type. Courts may well take the view that you have no further liability - and you may recover money's paid since you gave notice of termination relying on a principle of quantum meruit. If you were tricked into signing in the first place then it was void all along - but you will need a solicitor to pursue this line and recover the money already paid. There is another interesting question is that the legal entity that is purportedly making a contract with you is not identified in the standard documentation As far as we can tell, Jackie Skelly have never sued for breach of contract, which suggests that they are well aware of the weakness of their legal position. In fact they are seem to very keen to avoid the courts, presumably because they do not want their business practices - ranging from the dubious to the scandallous - to be exposed in open court. See the following interesting exchange of letters revealing the weakness of their position where they decline to initiate legal action, even though they purport to have been been defamed and to have suffered significant financial loss as a result. Aparently no amount of goading will push them into having their unethical business practices discussed in open court.
What Else can I do?Write to the Directors of Jackie Skelly telling them what you think
of their sales techniques and asking them to protect future customers
by stopping their dubious sales practices. You can find their names
and addresses here
Write to your local newspaper - taking care to stay factual and avoiding any temptation to exaggerate or say anything potentially libellous. The editor might welcome a scoop like this, so help him or her by making your story interesting and pointing out that yours is not an isolated case. If local papers pick it up, try a national newspaper too. Let us know of your experiences by e-mail: (just indicate if you want to use your real name or remain anonymous). If you have any threatening letters from debt collectors or solicitors we'll be happy to publish them too. If you are a victim and especially if you want to do something to publicise how monstrous Skellyweg's treatment of their ustomers is then again e-mail us. Let other people know about this website - if you have your own website add a link to this one incorporating the words "Jackie Skelly Membership" and "Complaint" into the title, keywords, heading and content. Print off this linked gif file, cut along the dotted lines, and pin up copies on public noticeboards or wherever - perhaps inside the Club you've been paying for unwillingly!
More about other victims of Jackie SkellyA page full of e-mails with with complaints about Jacky Skelly
Latest News on Jackie Skelly7 June 2009 . The Skellywegs have huge mortgages and an ever diminishing customer base. How much longer can they continue in business? It is a criminal offence for Directors to trade while technically insolvent (ie unable to meet their debts as they fall due). Anyone know whether it's weeks or months? Or are they already committing a criminal offence? 6 May 2009 . Still no response from Jackie Skelly's solicitors. Although the Skellywegs have been described unambiguously as "Theiving Scum" and despite their threats of legal action, none has been forthcoming. Basically they can't sue for libel because the accusation is true. They are Theiving Scum. 29 April 2009 . Great news! A victory for a Skellyweg victim in the small claims court. Read about it here. And here's the claim, and here's the cheque. Take heart - you can beat them too. 22nd February 2009 . A new letter to Jackie Skelly's solicitors, humiliating Jackie Skelly Fitness even more than the last one in October 2008. 18 December 2008. Jonathan Guthrie in the Financial Times (p13) predicts a grim time for health clubs in 2009: "With disposable incomes shrinking, far fewer would-be gym bunnies will sign those vital direct debit mandates". Can Jackie Skelly's with its overvalued properties, huge debt and shrinking membership survive 2009? 14 December 2008. 9:35 pm. "Prime Time Investigates" on RTE television reports on the cynical abuses by Jackie Skelly Fitness, including how their training manual encourages sales staff to manipulate their potential customers' weakness - or as the manual puts it "push their fat button". 8 December 2008. More interesting revelations from the inside of Jackie Skelly about the way the scam works. See e-mail. 1 Decemberr 2008. If you are prepared to talk publicly about your experiences with Jackie Skelly please e-mail the webmaster immediately. October 2008. A victory for JackieSkellyMembership.com. The National Consumer Agency has found that Jackie Skelly to be breaching multiple requirements of the European Communities (Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts), Regulations, 1995. Specifically
The Skellywegs have now revised their so called contract to make it less of a joke if it ever got cited in court. Some of the unenforceable terms have been rewritten. See this page for details of the NCA findings 6 October 2008. Letter from Jacques to Jackie Skelly's solicitors describing them as unethical, immoral, deceitful, appalling, money-grubbing, unscrupulous, scandalous, avaricious, grasping, rapacious, sordid, greedy, ravening, ruthless, venal, mercenary, dishonourable, dishonest, shady, unconscionable, voracious, contemptible, disgraceful, ignoble, seedy, shameful, shifty, sleazy, squalid, tawdry, unsavoury, degraded, discreditable, foul, reprehensible, and unprincipled. September 2008. Insider Information exclusive to JackieSkellyMembership Confirmation of yet more shady dealings by Jackie Skelly
August 2008. Reply from Skellyweg's solicitors to the last letter to them from Jacques + Jacques' Response Jackie Skelly have become even more devious in removing money from unwilling customers. We already knew that they will continuing taking money from customers by direct debit and by using customers' credit card details even after being informed them that no contract exists. It now seems that they have some way of extracting money from customers' Laser Card even without customers' permission. Several customers have complained that money has been extracted through their Laser Cards even though they have not authorised these payments or disclosed their PIN numbers. Our advice is never give them your Laser card details in any circumstances. Cancel any credit cards of which they have details. Likewise Direct Debits. They really are a bunch of disgusting leeches and will suck your blood in any way they can. Does anyone know how it is possible to extract money from a Laser card without the PIN number? And whatever the answer, is it legal? A number of people have started procedings against Jackie Skelly in the Small Claims Court. Great idea. More people should do this. Please let us know if you initiate procedings. A correspondant has suggested a coordinated effort at ringing the Joe Duffy/Gerry Ryan shows with horror stories about Skellywegs. Please let us know if you would be willing to call in and we'll organise a date. You can apply for a job as Jackie Skelly's Debt Collector & Club Administrator. No kidding - slick on the link links below to the adds. Interesting that Debt Collection is the first and most important qualification to be a Club Administrator. If these jobs have already gone, just do a Google Search with the four words Jackie Skelly Debt Collector for a whole lot more! Note this interesting line on Jackie Skelly's own recruitment page for sales consultants with commissions based on sales (see http://www.jackieskellyfitness.com/recruitment.asp)
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